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CARS: not 3rd person?

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  19:50:08  12 April 2003
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Hybrid_Genom
Külföldi
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 12/09/2002
Messages: 192
Well, i think it would be cool to play a car or a helicopter "sim" in Stalker but that won
  21:55:59  18 November 2003
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vilbert
President Evil
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 11/18/2003
Messages: 187
Hello to everyone. Im a noob here and I have few humble suggestions about cars.

OPERATING CARS


There should be option to change different keyboard/mouse setting on walking and driving. I would like to see TWO driving modes implemented into the game. Both of them should be easy to implement (what do I know?) and the first is the one I would really like to try out. Second one is basically a freelook mode.

You could change the driving modes just by pressing pre-defined (in car kb/mouse setup) button. For example mouse button 3.


Mouse steering mode:

Steering is operated by mouse X-axis. Gas and brake are operated trough mouse buttons. Optionally gas could be mouse wheel or Y-axis. Viewing direction of the player would be determined by the facing of front tires and current speed of the car. Here I presume that zero degrees is when looking directly forward when sitting in the car. Furthermore when tires are turned left 30 degrees I presume they are turned left 30 degrees and not facing (360 degrees - 30 degrees 330 degrees.

When using any forward gears or neutral viewing direction would be determined by a formula looking something like this: Angle of the tires minus speed (miles/h) (all the way down to 0. No negative values). The whole point is to set player looking at the direction the car would be going. When turning all the way in slow speeds player would see where he was turing to instead of just looking forward and crashing into objects and walls. When doing high speeds players eyes would be focused further ahead as in real life (hence only little head turning if at all). High speeds would mean that the car wouldnt turn quickly due to the momentum even if wheel was turned hard. An example: Player is doing 65km/h (40 mil/h) in a straight city road when another stalkers runs in front of him from the rubble. Wheel is immediately turned all the way to the right and the tires would be lets say 50 degrees right. Players view would now turn only (50-40 10 degrees right because of the high speed. Player straights the car and brakes to the right side of the street and turns full left to make a U turn. The speed is 11km/h (7 mil/h) when turning so the view would now be (50-7 43 degrees left. So now player can see clearly where he is turning to.

When changing to reverse the formula would look something like this: 160 degrees minus the angle of the tires. There could be a 10-20 degrees tolerance (left and right) in the steering where the soldiers head wouldn't turn to other side. This would minimize constant and confusing head turning and neck injury to the soldier. An example: Gear is put to reverse when tires are facing 2 degrees right and stalker turns his head (160-2 158 degrees right. Player tries to reverse straight but tires are constantly swaying 5 degrees left and right. Without the tolerance view would turn violently left and right causing severe
lumbago(?). Now that there would be lets say 15 degrees tolerance the head would turn to left side only when tires are turned to 15 or more degrees left. When reversing and turning fully (50 degrees) the player would be looking directly where he was turning to. View would be turned to (160-50 110 degrees.


I think with this mode (or better tuned mode) the drivin would be very intuitive and would only require a mouse. I hope dev team will atleas try it out if it really is easy to check out.

As I earlyer suggested you could change to a mouselook mode (by plessing mb 3 for example) for better view around.


Keyboard steering a.k.a mouselook mode:

Car manoeuvring is handled with w, a, s and d buttons the same way as in battlefields 1942. Mouse is used now for looking around. It would definately be a nice addition if you could shoot pistols while driving as -=
  23:13:07  18 November 2003
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Siphilus
Resident Synic
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 10/24/2003
Messages: 243
um.... its too early to read a post that long...
  11:56:23  19 November 2003
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Jinx Dragon
One of the mindless hoards
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 03/01/2003
Messages: 987
I think it should be first person, as if your looking on like normal, but the movement keys don't have to change all that much. Have the same left/right/forward/back to controll the car becouse your not going to need them sitting down behind the wheel. It only gets a touch more complicated if you have leaning, which could be done with the leaning keys, and the likes. This way mouse looks around like normal and you can fire a small firearm out the window or if your in the passanger side you can do a wider range of actions.
  15:08:10  19 November 2003
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vilbert
President Evil
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 11/18/2003
 

Message edited by:
vilbert
11/19/2003 15:21:28
Messages: 187
Yeah, first person is a must for me too. I dont mind if they make 3rd person view also. I just would never use it because it ruins immersion for me.

Good thing about using keyboard to steer is that you can use mouse to look/shoot around. Bad thing is that keyboard driving is jerky and many times implemented very poorly so that it looks like you were driving under heavy influence ramming into things constantly.

Steering with mouse would be much smoother but then you should also have a chance to look where you were turning to instead just stare straight ahead. This is why i suggester my "mouse steering mode" earlyer. this way you could operate car only with mouse alone. If that doesnt seem functional then you should atleast have a chance to look around with (for example q,e,a and d) keys while steering with mouse.

  16:01:58  19 November 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
I'm not sure

Mouse steering is done well in some games, keyboard is used to look left and right. Looking is limited though.

Then some use keyboard well, and use the mouse to look around.

It all depends on gameplay, which I can't comment on. I've never taken an old beater on a dirt road and tried to drive while shooting at a guy in tall grass...so I don't know how reasonable it would be to even have this as a feature. Now if the car is stopped sure, you may need to fight back.
  16:45:12  19 November 2003
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ravenutty
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/05/2003
Messages: 55
I liked the driving in Operation Flashpoint quite a lot (except that thing about not being able to turn the wheel to its full extent when driving fast):

You could either steer it with your mouse (you basically drove where you were pointing at.) The great thing was that while cornering the mouse pointer stayedon th piece of the road you were pointing at (difficult to explain, quite a lot like in Halo).

Sliding around corners with the car was a lot of fun, since it wasn't difficult to control.

The other method was steering it with the keyboard while looking around freely; you could also choose between 1st and 3rd person view. ( never used that feature, though)
  19:51:53  19 November 2003
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vilbert
President Evil
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 11/18/2003
 

Message edited by:
vilbert
11/20/2003 16:03:21
Messages: 187

---QUOTATION---
I liked the driving in Operation Flashpoint quite a lot (except that thing about not being able to turn the wheel to its full extent when driving fast):
---END QUOTATION---



I hadn't played Operation Flashpoint for awhile so I decided to try it again after I saw your post. As I remembered the driving is acceptable but could be better. However I didn't remember that when steering with mouse the view turned along with the tires a bit like in my earlyer suggestion. "a bit" because it doesnt take the speed in to account but only the angle of the tires. That is why the wheels cannot be turned in high speeds. In OFP if you could turn the wheels hard in high speed the view would turn hard too therefore killing orientation. Thats why (I strongly suspect) they decided to "lock" the wheel when speed was high. Furthermore I dont think the view turns enough when the wheel is turned fully.
Ofcourse the view doesn't turn to look behind in OFP when you are reversing.



---QUOTATION---
You could either steer it with your mouse (you basically drove where you were pointing at.) The great thing was that while cornering the mouse pointer stayedon th piece of the road you were pointing at (difficult to explain, quite a lot like in Halo).
---END QUOTATION---



I know what you mean. You basically turn the wheel certain amount (or point on the road that is turnin ahead) and while the car is turning the wheel straightens itself automatically. The bad side is that when you want to make a steep turn (or a U turn) you rapidly have to move your mouse to keep the wheel turned.



---QUOTATION---
The other method was steering it with the keyboard while looking around freely; you could also choose between 1st and 3rd person view. ( never used that feature, though)
---END QUOTATION---



When using keyboard the steering is too slow. My grandmother could turn the wheel faster (if alive). Mouselook is also too slow. If you glance 90 degrees right it takes you so long that the car is wandering off the road to a tree.

Its basically ok system in OFP but would need some fine tuning and additions.
  20:03:17  19 November 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
I find it tons easier to drive in first person because it's all about pointing the nose in the direction you want to go. Esp. in racers, which Stalker will not be. I would have used 1st person in OFP but the windows were always crappy. This may have been more reallistic but I felt my view was cut off more than it should be. I hate 3rd person diving because there is lag between the camera and where the car actually goes which makes it hard not to oversteer. So I don't know how to judge the steering in OFP, I think I remember hitting trees more often than I would IRL.
  21:34:42  20 November 2003
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huncowboy
(Novice)
 
On forum: 11/13/2003
Messages: 9
1st person driving is great. The way I like to play, but if all that it takes is to move the camera angel than lets provide the option for the 3rd person guys too. AND please do not make driving arcadeish. I don't wish for a full simulator but something like Mafia or Operation Flashpoint would be fine but for example the recent Hidden and Dangerous 2's driving sucked a$$.
 
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