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Gun that fires around corners

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  20:20:00  1 December 2003
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Gorgias
(Novice)
 
On forum: 11/06/2003
Messages: 5
Gun that fires around corners

They had a story about this one on the national news in Sweden a few days ago. Would it make a worthy addition to the game?

http://www.samizdata.net/blog/archives/004930.html

(If this link goes down, google for Israel "shoot around corners" and you'll find some link)

Daniel
  20:53:04  1 December 2003
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Tiny Shopkeeper
(Novice)
 
On forum: 12/21/2002
Messages: 25
In my opinion, I find it to be a complex solution to a small problem. Granted shooting at your enemy without exposing your squishy body is nice. But it's using a pistol when it can be done now with some success with a rifle with red dot optics (eotech, aimpoint, etc.) with practice. (Holding the rifle around the corner and exposing yourself just enough to see where the red dot is aiming).
  21:18:32  1 December 2003
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vilbert
President Evil
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On forum: 11/18/2003
 

Message edited by:
vilbert
12/01/2003 21:19:30
Messages: 187
You could have a camera attached to your aimpoint and the view could be transmitted to your other eye via cable. Viewing device would be like those NV goggles they have attached to helmets. You could now just point the gun around corner and shoot people accurately as if you would be shooting them trough aimpoint itself. In addition you could shoot accurately from the hip too
  21:21:10  1 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
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On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
Yeah it would be just like playing a game with a crosshair in...the....middle, wait. All games are like that.

At least the ones without IRONSIGHTS.
  22:13:26  1 December 2003
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Kasto
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/11/2003
Messages: 93

---QUOTATION---
They had a story about this one on the national news in Sweden a few days ago. Would it make a worthy addition to the game?
---END QUOTATION---


IMO it yould be a waist of time.
  01:57:01  2 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
 

Message edited by:
x5060
12/02/2003 1:57:25
Messages: 2015
These weapons are nothing new. The Nazi's during WW2 made a modified Mp40 that shot around corners.


Edit: and i think they would be a waste of time in this game.
  03:23:40  2 December 2003
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pentazemine
(Senior)
 
On forum: 11/28/2003
Messages: 66
reminds me of a nerf gun i had when i was younger
  03:45:10  2 December 2003
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Zig
Ye Oulde Zigge
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 11/21/2003
Messages: 315
info about the germans was already stated in the article he linked to, smarty

what about the LANDWARRIOR SYSTEM?

aka clunkyass camera-attached-to-your-gun
  11:45:56  2 December 2003
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vilbert
President Evil
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On forum: 11/18/2003
 

Message edited by:
vilbert
12/02/2003 11:46:55
Messages: 187

---QUOTATION---

what about the LANDWARRIOR SYSTEM?

aka clunkyass camera-attached-to-your-gun
---END QUOTATION---




What! Damn them for ripping off my idea already

  15:05:46  2 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
info about the germans was already stated in the article he linked to, smarty
---END QUOTATION---



Didnt read the entirfe article, but that histori weapon was CRAZY, id never seen an STG44 used to shoot around corners. I'd only seen the Mp40 and the Mg42's that they had modified.


---QUOTATION---
what about the LANDWARRIOR SYSTEM?

aka clunkyass camera-attached-to-your-gun
---END QUOTATION---



Id love to see the landwarrior system in the game, but it would be really hard to emulate everything you can do with it.


---QUOTATION---

What! Damn them for ripping off my idea already

---END QUOTATION---



Yeah, well they started ripping off your idea about 6 years ago.
  15:42:22  2 December 2003
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Kasto
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/11/2003
Messages: 93

---QUOTATION---

Yeah, well they started ripping off your idea about 6 years ago.

---END QUOTATION---


lol
  18:20:08  2 December 2003
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Jinx Dragon
One of the mindless hoards
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On forum: 03/01/2003
Messages: 987
If I remember right, the reason such weapons where not very populer was becouse htey where designed to fire around corners, aka NOT STRAIGHT. It would be hell to aim at someone and the only use would be suppressive fire as you wouldn't be able to see... the MP40 and tommy (think it had one to, for anti-tank use) are light enough you can hold the gun around the corner and fire anyway.

The most it was used for was shooting tank teams through the little slots as they cowered in place barrels couldn't normaly point becouse it was a inch wide slit and you couldn't angle it to shoot in some areas.
  14:24:16  6 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
If I remember right, the reason such weapons where not very populer was becouse htey where designed to fire around corners, aka NOT STRAIGHT. It would be hell to aim at someone and the only use would be suppressive fire as you wouldn't be able to see... the MP40 and tommy (think it had one to, for anti-tank use) are light enough you can hold the gun around the corner and fire anyway.

The most it was used for was shooting tank teams through the little slots as they cowered in place barrels couldn't normaly point becouse it was a inch wide slit and you couldn't angle it to shoot in some areas.
---END QUOTATION---



They had mirrors and angles optics so they could shoot around corners and still be accurate.
  21:02:17  6 December 2003
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serp
whats this?
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 02/27/2003
Messages: 621
i think he meant more of having to shoot someone while pointing the gun not at him, its kinda awkward.
  21:47:13  6 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
i think he meant more of having to shoot someone while pointing the gun not at him, its kinda awkward.
---END QUOTATION---



Ohh, yeah that would be odd.
  10:25:19  8 December 2003
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Jinx Dragon
One of the mindless hoards
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On forum: 03/01/2003
Messages: 987
Yep thats what I ment, aiming at someone you can see with a twisted barrel wouldn't be good.
  18:49:58  8 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
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On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008

---QUOTATION---
Yep thats what I ment, aiming at someone you can see with a twisted barrel wouldn't be good.
---END QUOTATION---



Are you nuts?
Why do you think bendy-staws were invented?
Bendy barrels would be sweet and would probably turn the tide of a war.

*If that war was against the rainbow nation*
Not going to explain,ask your mom.
  19:40:15  9 December 2003
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horizor
Resident Evil
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On forum: 11/22/2003
Messages: 312
how about just being able to fire blindly over/around cover? Might be nice to just keep people away.
  21:57:49  9 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
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On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
Doesn't work like it does in the movies.
I'd rather change my location/cover if I see a gun and no head poking around a corner rather then when there is not.
It's the perfect time to move, if you get hit by a bullet it's because God doesn't like you.
They are blasting away making noise meanwhile you've covered some ground and they don't know where you went.
  06:32:42  10 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
how about just being able to fire blindly over/around cover? Might be nice to just keep people away.
---END QUOTATION---



mentioned


---QUOTATION---
It would be hell to aim at someone and the only use would be suppressive fire as you wouldn't be able to see...
---END QUOTATION---



You arent blind, nor do you ever fire a weapon blindly in war time (or anytime), you are more likely to hit your own people.
  09:39:05  17 December 2003
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tobiat
(Senior)
 
On forum: 12/17/2003
Messages: 57
Speacial forces around the world use the camera on a gun method, so i see no reason why you couldnt implement it other than bateries are expensive now-a-days, let alone in a baren waste land
  14:18:52  17 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 10/09/2003
 

Message edited by:
Doc Jones
12/17/2003 14:22:30
Messages: 2008

---QUOTATION---
Speacial forces around the world use the camera on a gun method, so i see no reason why you couldnt implement it other than bateries are expensive now-a-days, let alone in a baren waste land
---END QUOTATION---



Or guys don't use em too often from what I've seen. I've kicked quite a few of those guys out of planes and they have just basic scopes or nothing on them. I don't know why, never occured to me they would be using them so never asked why they didn't have them. Maybe they are at risk to getting broken on jumps and would use them otherwise, or maybe they don't trust them.

Edit: Not saying they couldn't be used in the game however. I personally am not a big fan of them though. You don't have a wide FOV (assume not otherwise the screen would have to be like a TV to aim), and would have to move the gun around a lot if you need to check out a large area for anyone hiding. Down a corridor yeah, but otherwise someone who is not in the camera's FOV can take a pot shot at the gun. I prefer a quick peek myself. Course I might feel different if it was my melon on the line.
  20:07:47  17 December 2003
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Fux0r666
resident smart-ass
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 06/04/2003
Messages: 1927
I believe the systems that tobiat is referring to are wired to a vr helmet like apparatus so you can see where the gun is pointing without sighting it. There's no reason just to have a camera television output on top of the rifle where a scope would suffice. It would be lunacy.

I do not believe they are as common or as wide spread as he would have you believe, though.
  22:20:40  17 December 2003
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tobiat
(Senior)
 
On forum: 12/17/2003
Messages: 57
well i have never seen a speacial forces unit first hand, hence no experience, but i have read a bit and have seen the technology. it is big and clunky and would affect your aiming time as someone mentioned in another thread. i just have heard stories of them being used, but i spose thats like the media to misleed you about your supremecy(not sure if thats a word)
  00:40:36  18 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
My special forces training was in aircraft maintenance. Didn't have to go through what the grunts do but we did have to play the same games. Most guys in my job get to stay in hotels, but since we rarely operated out of a 'base' we had to rough it. Hehe make more money and no place to spend it, so I liked it, I always liked camping. Heck I didn't have to set up the tents.

But from my experience talking to some of the guys. There are some things that they get to do that are pretty cool, mainly techniques and tools they test out just to see how they work. But most of the stuff they use on the missions I've seen them on are pretty standard stuff. It's mostly just training, they are just immersed with their team. Make all our guys feel like kids even though some of us were clearly older than most of them.

So, from what I've seen. There is the normal stuff we use constantly, pretty standard stuff. There is the cool tech you see on TV which we use rarely and only in very specific situations but actually has been in experimentation for years. Then there is the stuff you don't see that blows that stuff out of the water, but is either impractical at the time or needs a lot of work. Kind of like a car show. The stuff everyone uses, the stuff manufacturers want people to try, and the stuff manufacturers don't want anyone to know about yet.
  02:03:59  18 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
Speacial forces around the world use the camera on a gun method, so i see no reason why you couldnt implement it other than bateries are expensive now-a-days, let alone in a baren waste land
---END QUOTATION---



The landwarrior system is in the owrks however it is not battelfield ready by any means.
  16:59:06  18 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
One cool think I would like to see if some sort of good infared system. AvP did a good job, not really reallistic but it was cool how it worked for game balance.

I love playing with the infared systems the military has. They are slow sometimes but the detail is amazing. 'Course I'm talking about an aircraft installed system. Which I will just say weighs more than you want to carry. But you would swear you were using night vision. You can see detail in pavement. I don't think is operates on brightness=heat. Since things that are have fairly little difference in heat, like pavement, can show a variety of variation, while much warmer objects, like engines many 100x degrees, are brighter you can still see detail in them too. It seems to assign brightness in a smart way so that on the same screen, cold things just a fraction of a degree in variance still show the same detail as very hot objects with great ranges in temperature between nearby features. Really cool stuff.

But I have no idea how small the technology is now.
  01:44:33  19 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
One cool think I would like to see if some sort of good infared system. AvP did a good job, not really reallistic but it was cool how it worked for game balance.

I love playing with the infared systems the military has. They are slow sometimes but the detail is amazing. 'Course I'm talking about an aircraft installed system. Which I will just say weighs more than you want to carry. But you would swear you were using night vision. You can see detail in pavement. I don't think is operates on brightness=heat. Since things that are have fairly little difference in heat, like pavement, can show a variety of variation, while much warmer objects, like engines many 100x degrees, are brighter you can still see detail in them too. It seems to assign brightness in a smart way so that on the same screen, cold things just a fraction of a degree in variance still show the same detail as very hot objects with great ranges in temperature between nearby features. Really cool stuff.

But I have no idea how small the technology is now.
---END QUOTATION---



Are you talking about the FLIR (Forward looking Infrared) System? The inherent problem with Infrared visual equipment is that its not very detailed. This is because A)Heat spreads out quickly B) the wavelength dosent allow for the waves to be focused. There isnt a way to make a lense to focus Infrared light. So to get round this the military took a simple aproach of combining 2 technologies that they were already using. They combined the IR equipment with NV and created FLIR. The details you see with that system is not the IR but the NV system overlaying the IR.
  14:58:28  19 December 2003
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Doc Jones
Older than before
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On forum: 10/09/2003
Messages: 2008
Ah, cool. That makes more sense. Baby takes a bit to get adjusted to the temperature outside. Never did ask the pin heads how it worked, had too much fun playing with it.
  23:15:58  19 December 2003
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
Ah, cool. That makes more sense. Baby takes a bit to get adjusted to the temperature outside. Never did ask the pin heads how it worked, had too much fun playing with it.
---END QUOTATION---



Haha, I love military tech. They come up with such inventive things that do really cool stuff. They also develop such low tech solutions to high tech problems.
  06:54:31  8 March 2005
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Dark-AI
(Novice)
 
On forum: 03/06/2005
 

Message edited by:
Dark-AI
03/08/2005 7:05:22
Messages: 10

---QUOTATION---
Gun that fires around corners

They had a story about this one on the national news in Sweden a few days ago. Would it make a worthy addition to the game?

http://www.samizdata.net/blog/archives/004930.html

(If this link goes down, google for Israel "shoot around corners" and you'll find some link)

Daniel
---END QUOTATION---




Woulden't a better system be just to have a normal weapon with a scope, and have a special attachment that would screw onto the eyepiece of the scope?

The attachment would be an optical cable focus piece with an optical cable running from it that would screw down onto the eye piece of the weapon scope, and the optical cable from the focus piece would be about three foot long and would end in a monocle that would be attached to the eye of the person using the weapon, and would be either held in place similar to a pirates eye patch or held in place by a sunglasses type frame.

That way a soldier could sight down the scope while firing the weapon from the hip, or while crouching behind a wall and holding his weapon above him over the wall. I dont know the finer details of getting an obtical cable link between the weapon scope and a human eye and have it well focused but I know with the right knowledge and some ingenuity it can be done.

The whole thing, Focus piece, cable and monocle would be small, light and take seconds to attach and remove due to the simple screw on action.

Another advantage would be that any scope capable weapon could have this upgrade attached to it, along with the fact that the soldiers eye would always be in near perfect alignment with the scope's sighting and possible target, even when jerking the weapon around (which could be disorienting at first).

A nice Low-Tech shoot round corners system which is also good for normal use and without need of a special custom built from scratch weapon, through the eyepice of the scope may need to be replaced to acomodate the screw on Cable Focus piece.

The system could work with any type of scope, including Infra red and light amplification, anything that has a visual feed the human eye can understand.
Even better is that it doesn't need batteries.



Ideas, suggestions anyone?
  21:12:44  8 March 2005
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Fux0r666
resident smart-ass
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 06/04/2003
Messages: 1927
Depending on the role of the weapon.. there are good and bad points about strapping a cam-corder to a glock.

The americans have a concept that similar to what you are talking about in their landwarrior system, I think. The scope on the top uses some kind of cctv camera that transmits to the soldier's eyepiece.
  12:29:16  12 March 2005
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Dark-AI
(Novice)
 
On forum: 03/06/2005
Messages: 10
What advantages would a CCTV setup have over a fibre optic system other than not having an optic cable between the weapon and the eyepiece? Hope its water and dirt proof as well as being resilient to hard knocks, the batteries ought to last a long time. Could I have a link to the CCTV system for more info?
  14:08:07  12 March 2005
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Gm0nx
(Novice)
 
On forum: 03/12/2005
 

Message edited by:
Gm0nx
03/12/2005 14:11:15
Messages: 27
How about this..

I just googl'd around and found exactly what i was thinking about:
http://home.att.net/~mikel/chards/scope-3.jpg

Although this isn't what i meant, it looks like how i meant it..
How about this, you could attach it to your gunscope and look around corners without exposing yourself..
I think it would be pretty cool..
  15:14:49  12 March 2005
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
How about this..

I just googl'd around and found exactly what i was thinking about:
http://home.att.net/~mikel/chards/scope-3.jpg

Although this isn't what i meant, it looks like how i meant it..
How about this, you could attach it to your gunscope and look around corners without exposing yourself..
I think it would be pretty cool..
---END QUOTATION---



huh? I have no idea what you are talking about.
  15:54:11  12 March 2005
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Gm0nx
(Novice)
 
On forum: 03/12/2005
 

Message edited by:
Gm0nx
03/12/2005 15:55:28
Messages: 27
Sorry..

Yeah, i didn't put it clearly.
But my idea was something like how a periscope in a submarine works.
So you can screw it on your normal scope so you can view around corners, the principal works with mirrors reflecting.
  20:13:52  12 March 2005
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Fux0r666
resident smart-ass
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 06/04/2003
Messages: 1927
CCTV just means closed circuit tv. It broadcasts nothing, and is connected with a cable. advantages over fibre optics? cheaper.
 
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