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 00:38:06 6 June 2012 |
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xoen
Senior Resident
On forum: 06/10/2011
Message edited by:
xoen
06/06/2012 0:45:28
Messages: 248
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yes, right, name's sunshafts there...
BUT, i think that darkening of volumetric shadow may be related to:
a). enb preset used(some option)/fxaa injector + stalker shader,
b). stalker user.ltx( HDR/brightness/contrast) relation.
c). both of above....
i think, that it is possible to set it properly(i mean brighter shadows while being inside of shadowed area, not perfectly, but quite ok, at last), because i remember having it quite bright together with no-too-bright rest of image.
but, since i messed up with whole thing, i lost proper settings...so i turned it off.
it may be fixable with messing up with "scene illumination", since it sets darkest part of image, but i cannot check it now, my DVI-DVI cable JUST broke, ffs(when i just launched stalker, DAMN).
ok, off to laptop and dwarf fortress...until i get dvi cable tomorrow, sigh...
i did care.
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| 23:02:17 9 June 2012 |
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FatalFunnel
(Senior)
On forum: 11/07/2011
Messages: 133
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---QUOTATION---
hm all i can see is volumetric lights + shadow diffuse there...
am i missing something?
i know who you are, that's why i am asking question like this.
volumetric lights works weird, i mean volumetrics work EXACTLY opposite of how it should(when we are in shadows, shadowed area should be brighten, that if seen from outside of shadowed area).
i never understood this behaviour in stalker.
it reminds me weird ARMA hdr brightening/eye adaptation, same issue - works OPPOSITE from proper way(whole screen dims when we point to dim areas and brightens when we point to bright areas there).
anyway, this is why i am not using volumetrics in stalker, it is just done wrong way;/
---END QUOTATION---
Would it be possible to invert it somehow? |
| 14:31:38 10 June 2012 |
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xoen
Senior Resident
On forum: 06/10/2011
Message edited by:
xoen
06/10/2012 19:16:24
Messages: 248
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---QUOTATION---
I'd prefer to remove that behavior from the shader's code.
---END QUOTATION---
---QUOTATION---
Would it be possible to invert it somehow?
---END QUOTATION---
hm, i wonder, i just checked(STALKER Shaders MAX 1.05) and i found two files interesting:
accum_sun_far.ps
accum_sun_near.ps
and i assume, some !!SCIENCE!! could do miracles there.
there's nothing related to sun_shafts in other shader files, btw, so i assume, all we need is experiment with proper things there(notice how resulting brightness of shadows/volumetrics is accumulated there and what is affecting overall effect - many variables are cumulating DEPENDENTLY on which quality of shaders is in use, IN GENERAL(notice "if, then"'s)).
my point is, that there's possibility to get very interesting effects, if i am right.
i did care.
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| 23:31:57 11 June 2012 |
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xoen
Senior Resident
On forum: 06/10/2011
Message edited by:
xoen
06/12/2012 0:26:52
Messages: 248
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---QUOTATION---
however you'll need to understand quite a bit of that code in order to implement something intended, not only random.
&
This said, "inverting" the effect might be easy if you exactly know what to tweak and where - but otherwise you'll probably end up in a mess of lighting artifacts behaving very weird
---END QUOTATION---
hey, i know this, i am not retarded...
indeed, matter is complicated.
i am not a matematician, so my way of analyzing thing may be funny then.
---
notification to myself(thinking aloud):
shadows are barely visible when sunshafts are on(i mean they are washed), almost invisible from distance. BUT, it is not happening when sunshafts are OFF. ergo, "waning effect" is strictly related to parts when sunshafts are defined/used. for same reason, shadow.h is not needed to be edited.
upd: since shadows are dark when we are NEAR of them, and washed out when distant(relatively)distance factor is clearly used. by averaging value, or restricting it properly, we can obtain needed effect(more or less constant, with small range of changes).
probable usefulness of contrast factor is disputable.
notification no.2:
SS_FARNEARLERP is NOT used, so sections where this term is used in both files may be skipped.
i did care.
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| 15:26:56 12 June 2012 |
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Meltac
messing with code
(Resident)
On forum: 01/21/2010
Message edited by:
Meltac
06/12/2012 15:27:33
Messages: 1519
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On second thought - of further research -, the way that the engine illuminates the scene when sun shafts are enabled might be fairly correct. Look at these real world examples:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/220/520205195_c6ca9e318d.jpg
http://www.goodwp.com/nature/20338-forest-tree-light-ray-sun.html
Here the objects (e.g. trees) behind the sun shafts seem to be lit although they are located in a dark area without sunlight. So it seems that when you look through a volumetric ray of light those objects beyond it will appear lighter / brighter than they would when you are close to them. It's a little like the effect of nightvision goggles, or opposite to sunglasses - an filtering effect that is applied relatively to the viewer under specific viewing conditions (that are: viewer's positions, volumetric light's position, color, and intensity).
So, to come back to the initial video, that means when you look into that buildings corner from further way, it seems to be lit, because the sunlight beam traversing between the viewer and the corner seems to enlighten the dark areas beyond it - whereas when you go close into that corner you'll "pass" the sunlight beam and leave that light source behind you, resulting in the original image of the dark corner without the additional lighting of the sunlight in front of it.
Of course this only happens when the light beam's angle is at most orthogonal to the dark corner and not shining directly into it, because otherwise the corner would be lit under any viewing perspectives.
Was that more or less understandable? It's complex matter as you say.
Something considered impossible is only something that hasn't been done yet.
☢ Dynamic Shaders: www.moddb.com/mods/dynamic-shaders
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| 00:45:54 13 June 2012 |
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xoen
Senior Resident
On forum: 06/10/2011
Message edited by:
xoen
06/13/2012 3:11:46
Messages: 248
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when you look through a volumetric ray of light those objects beyond it will appear lighter / brighter
i agree, that's quite obvious.
---QUOTATION---
than they would when you are close to them.
---END QUOTATION---
indeed.
now, sorry for my english below, i was in forest today, sitting for a hour in shadowed area, and i was thinking:
skip volumetrics in case when you are standing in shadows looking on shadowed area: when you are in shadows, nearby shadowed area should be bit lighter for your eyes, than when you are outside of that shadow.
so, what i mean, is, that overdarkening of shadows is the problem, from my point of view, not sunshaft brightness addition to dark area. but BOTH things are happening there at the same time, notice.
that differs from effect on photos you posted(btw, great pics there). shadows are visible on photographs and are not darkened at all.
another thing:
notice again, shadows are visible on photos that you posted, while in stalker, sunshafts=on removes ALL shadows from relatively near distance up to FAR area(tbh shadows are visible just near you).
so, we can see few things when sunshafts are on:
-brightness rises behind sunshaft regardless of area behind, and it is OK, looks neat, etc etc.
-shadowed area outside of sunshaft is darkened(TOO MUCH) when we are in shadowed area,
-shadows are invisible when we are looking far - something related to sunshaft behaviour is waning shadows TO REMOVE DISTANT sunshaft processing, IMHO, as shadows are strictly linked to sunshaft code, or better, lnikage is made to prevent engine from processing up-to-horizon sunshaft rendering what RESULTS in shadows dissapearance.
notice, that stalker sunshafts are rendered in NEAR distance only.
so, i think, that:
a. forcing sunshafts to FAR point will make shadows visible(but it may make FPS drop + weird look in general),
b. changing contrast of shadows in volumetred areas would make em..well, brighter when you are in shadows(and it removes need of doing point a. then), BUT i doubt, that it change FAR visibility of shadows;/
now, i wonder, if it is made on purpose. btw i do not remember, how it is made in clear sky, but i think that sunshafts were not removing shadows in distance AND engine was not processing sunshafts in FAR areas, am i right?
hmmm, maybe it could be good idea to look onto CS shaders regarding that matter?
btw, i just watched your vid again, and, imho, "inshadow darkening" is main problem(as i stated before, generally), can you agree?
for me, far shadow dissapearance is second one(open areas NEED far shadow visibility, imo).
can you post CS shaders pack? i'd like to compare sunshaft sections...
i did care.
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| 16:07:46 14 June 2012 |
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xoen
Senior Resident
On forum: 06/10/2011
Message edited by:
xoen
06/14/2012 16:53:07
Messages: 248
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---QUOTATION---
xoen - what comparing tool is that? and what Windows theme for that matter...
---END QUOTATION---
this is "compare contents" from total commander(modded powerpack in my case, but function is default one here). i am unable to use Windows without TC anymore.
of course, i joined three screenshots to make one.
theme(winxp ONLY) i am using is heavily modified by me, i do not remember its original name(lightroom 'something'), it was not as space efficient and optimized, as my version, though..also, i made start menu and menu, uh, start nicer, than in orginal theme...i narrowed taskbars, windowbar, and i made some color changes, and other tweaks.
here's what it does look like(i mean my one, not original):
http://www.mm.pl/~xoen/xothemea.jpg
and here's link:
http://www.mm.pl/~xoen/xoxptheme.zip
very space efficient and it is not hogging GUI(as many themes do). i used every method for optimization i could use there.
we all know how HARD is to make dark themes for windows, this is one, that can be used on daily basis(least background-to-font color problems - thing that differs linux dark themes from windows themes/GUI way of handling main font color;/).
upd: ah, shit, i forgot to add font i am using for some skin elements, NINA(it is VERY narrow font that is real space saver, though i am not using it in total commander itself):
http://www.mm.pl/~xoen/nina.jpg
(notice, that font viewer is from total commander too - key F3).
http://www.mm.pl/~xoen/nina.zip
if colors from just applying theme differ from screenshot, here's my exported color profile for js3dcc(color theme editor/loader, tool named "3d color" sometimes):
http://www.mm.pl/~xoen/xodark.zip
color profile can be used standalone, with themes turned off(so everything is used with nonskinned oldstyle GUI).
feel free to mail me, if you encounter any problems, or have questions.
i did care.
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