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Traditional RPG elements?

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  09:57:27  7 February 2003
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Mad Max RW
(Novice)
 
On forum: 01/01/2003
 

Message edited by:
Mad Max RW
02/07/2003 9:58:29
Messages: 44
Except it isn't role playing when all you do is run around killing the samn shit over and over to reach the next level. MMORPG's are NOT RPG's. They're massive multiplayer leveling treadmills. Nothing more. You can try to role play, but the games force you to follow the same goal. Nonlinear doesn't mean RPG.
  10:10:26  7 February 2003
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Psychoo
(Novice)
 
On forum: 01/02/2003
Messages: 45
I think that traditional rpg elements like turn based system or skill improvement is only necessary when the character you play is completely different in their attributes like a usual human being. If your character is a superhero or from another race, turn based system is necessary, cause u cannot react in 0,0001 seconds in realtime mode like a superhero. In stalker your character is a human, with usual human abilites using technology to handicap special abilites like mind controlling. In this case adding attributes or skills to your charater is totally senseless, 'cause there won't be any results.
For example: What kind of effect does adding +2 to reaction time in realtime?? Nothing. It can be shown only in turn based system, like u have 1 more action points.
Maybe some attributes can be controlled in realtime but it is very hard. For example perception. If u add perception attribute to a stalker caharcter, it can result in the game that your crosshair is shakeing. When you increase your perception skill the crosshair doesn't shakes so much, and when you reach the peak of this skill your crosshair stops shakeing. But this sounds SHIT for me, and i cannot imagine what other way could result any good effect in a realtime game!
And a question:
What does it mean that there are NO REAL RPG-s on pc? So where are they?
  12:21:18  8 February 2003
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Mad Max RW
(Novice)
 
On forum: 01/01/2003
Messages: 44

---QUOTATION---

What does it mean that there are NO REAL RPG-s on pc? So where are they?
---END QUOTATION---



Ever hear of Pen and Paper? That's how it started and no PC game comes close (except maybe Fallout) to the attention to detail.
  20:57:02  24 February 2003
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Thanatos
(Novice)
 
On forum: 02/23/2003
Messages: 13
We can all argue about what a RPG is and isn't until the cows come home, but that won't make this RPG/FPS work. I think the guys at Stalker want to have a enough RPG mix to make it original and customizable, without having the complexities of a full-blow RPG. As opposed to having a game where it's "who has the best made character" it's "who has the most FPS skill", coupled with the customization to make their character "different". This makes the FPSers happy(which IS a large fan-base then the RPGers), and still pleases some less hardcore RPGers. And makes the game's replayibility go up.

When I look at a game with the words RPG in it, I look for three things:

Dialog Tree. This is part of any RPG, with the ability to create a character based on speech as well as actions. Games like Metal Gear Solid are great, but thats also a linear game. Since this is a non-linear game, this is a must. I would like to see blocking with the dialog; while you see blocking in fixed-dialog games, there is not a bunch of RPGs with this out there. This would be better if in Dialog you go to a 3-party view, but still it would be nice in first-person to see the other person not talk with the life of an animated corpse.

Customization. There has to be some ways to make your character different from the people around you, or for that matter, different from the last character you made. Be it stats, skills, or appearences, there must be some element. Since it's skills here it seems, make them have a somewhat large effect on gameplay.

Allied NPCs. When not in co-op mode, you don't have luxury of some-one guarding your back. Thats why there are in-party NPCs. Be it a medic to heal you, a soilder to give support fire, or a gang of Stalkers proclaiming you their new leader, you need um. If you're social. Be it that it's only for a few minutes, as you stand back to back with a soldier helping him to reclaim his camp, it's nice to have um. Also, it's nice to be able to interact with them to issue orders, make them change weapons, or engage in idle chat. One-liners and perhaps even having some *cough* "fun" with the opposite sex.

I'm not looking for a knock-off of another game though, and so comparision don't help, but I would to like to see such interactions between the user and the player.


- Thanatos
  21:21:19  24 February 2003
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Hybrid_Genom
Külföldi
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 12/09/2002
Messages: 192

---QUOTATION---
...different from the last character you made. Be it stats, skills, or appearences, there must be some element. Since it's skills here it seems, make them have a somewhat large effect on gameplay.
---END QUOTATION---



There will be no character building in Stalker. Appearance for sure but no skills you can improve and level up like in RPG
  21:39:38  24 February 2003
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Thanatos
(Novice)
 
On forum: 02/23/2003
Messages: 13
Oh, sorry, I was under the impression that a Stalker to learn skills, meaning, in this sense, an actual skill as opposed to something that is an upgrade.

Such as learning breathing exercises from a great sniper, or learning to skin a deer from a hunter.

Guess I wasn't reading the FAQ closely enough the first time I went through it.


- Thanatos
  22:02:06  24 February 2003
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Hybrid_Genom
Külföldi
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 12/09/2002
Messages: 192
No need to say sorry

I think the skills that matter will be the knowledge of the Zone, to know how it works like, the anomalies and Zone life in general and i think you will mostly have to figure it out on your own.

I read somewhere that you will start the game together with an old experienced Stalker.

Maybe he will tell you some tricks or like you said skills but i think it will be more like informations.
  23:01:09  24 February 2003
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-=¤willhaven¤=-
Senior Resident
 

 
On forum: 02/12/2003
Messages: 299
yeah that would be cool

starting off with a fellow stalker that teaches you the ropes... gives you items now and then... you can even go on missions with the guy

then later in the game they yank on your heart strings and kill the guy right in front of you...

they dont do that enough in games... and if they do its the typical max payne/getaway "they killed my wife" scenario... cheesy. you need to be involved with the character on a gameplay level... not just 30 seconds worth of cutscenes
  23:39:34  24 February 2003
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Thanatos
(Novice)
 
On forum: 02/23/2003
 

Message edited by:
Thanatos
02/24/2003 23:41:25
Messages: 13
Heh, I've always been a fan of the in-game cutscenes (am I contradicting myself?)(Yes, yes you are). Similar to games like Half-life and Metal of Honor 2. Something along the lines of:

You watch has they gun down the stalker. The stalker that has meant so much to you, who you've felt is more like a father to you then anyone else you've ever know.

Dialog tree pops up:
1)I'LL KILL YOU ALL FOR THIS!!
The whip-out-the-gun-and-hose-um-all-down kinda guy choice.
2)I'll make you all pay. The run-away-and-pick-them-off-one-by-one-later kinda guy choice.
3)Heh, I never liked the old man anyways. Need a hand killing more? The eeeeeeeeeviiillllllllllllll kinda guy choice.

All three lend to your character in a different way, and all three change the ways your guy could take.

Heh, also I think it would be great if due to your action overall, your "karma", your character changes in little, harmless ways. Like if you where the macho good guy you'd have a proud, fierce stare, while if you where the silent death kinda guy you'd have a shadowy-eyed, gaunt appearant, and if you were eevvilllll you'd have a snear. Little. Harmless. Ways. Great for meeting other people online. (If char imports happened.)


- Thanatos
  18:17:40  3 March 2003
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Psychologus
(Senior)
 
On forum: 02/22/2003
Messages: 70

---QUOTATION---
What's the key word? ROLE!! You PLAY a ROLE.

Ever hear of Pen and Paper? That's how it started and no PC game comes close (except maybe Fallout) to the attention to detail.

---END QUOTATION---



Yeah if you ever played a non PC RPG you know it is all not only for character statistics it is all for a GOOD STORY. The role playing means you have a good adventure nad play a ROLE in it. That is why I wouldnt call all that "non plot" games like Morrowind as a true RPG games. They used to call them non linear but they actually are plotless too - VERY BORING!!! I would claim firs System Shock more like an RPG game (and better example for stalker as it also hasn't have any stats to upgrate and all it was based on was a good story telling, techs to colect and logs to read)


---QUOTATION---

Nonlinear doesn't mean RPG.

---END QUOTATION---



An I would say RPG never meant TALKING WITH EVERYONE ABOUT EVERYTHING like you use to do in games like Morrowind. It was all about PLAYING YOUR ROLE, PRETENDING, BEING SMART, and talking only with imagined important characters which made you an impression of participating in something INTERSTING - A PLOT, A STORY

So for me ther is no need for Clasic RPG stats system but I would be very bored if it would be like do what you like, talk with who you like, go where you like.... it make no sence as it does not give the-player-the-hero any MOTIVATION ANY DESIRE!!! I consider all good character have to have their deep motives, goals, wishes.... whcih makes them to run the plot and to go in coflicts (not only fighting for certain artifacts). Good conflict of characters is actually one of the basics of good script writing
 
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