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  02:20:47  22 November 2004
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x5060
Resident Nobody
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On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015

---QUOTATION---
where's the guy who said no Marines would use a tube fed shotgun?
---END QUOTATION---



Hes not talkign anymore...

Love the icon!
  07:25:52  22 November 2004
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Fux0r666
resident smart-ass
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On forum: 06/04/2003
Messages: 1927
Lol. Someone musta corked his ass so he could no longer talk out of it.
  16:09:27  22 November 2004
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Harry-the-Ruskie
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/07/2004
 

Message edited by:
Harry-the-Ruskie
11/22/2004 16:12:49
Messages: 75
"Corked his ass" ?

I think he is referring to me.

I didn't say no US Marine will ever use a tube magazine shotgun. What I said was this :-

1. There are advantages of a box magazine over a tube. Every assualt rifle today is box magazine fed and I was making a reverse analogy that probably no US Marine will want to swap to tube system from a box.

2. It follows therefore that if they were re-evaluating for a new inter-Service shotgun then it makes sense to consider something in the configuration of the USAS-12 as an example. That same point was also mentioned by several gunwriters in several magazines....I think Dave Spaulding was one of them.

3. As it is, as x5060 pointed out, that evaluation program is already now long defunct. They (the Marines) have decided after evaluation that based on ongoing requirements, current shotgun models with tube feed and perhaps pistol grips will suffice and there's no further need to embark on another expensive re-equipment exercise.

4. As for "corked my ass", well I have not been following this thread...I thought it ended after x5060 replied with the conclusive answer. Nor have I been visiting this Forum everyday. Admittedly, there's not really all that much to talk bout in this Forum without much of a platform in the form of a tangible STALKER game to discuss.

5. And Fux0r66, no one can qualify as someone arrogant enough to know about everything, least of all me. That's why I like having discussions so that ideas may be shared and along the way I learn something new. Of course, in your case you are certainly the exception to all that. You know everything.

Have a nice day.
  01:09:21  23 November 2004
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Fux0r666
resident smart-ass
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On forum: 06/04/2003
 

Message edited by:
Fux0r666
11/23/2004 1:13:36
Messages: 1927

---QUOTATION---
And Fux0r66, no one can qualify as someone arrogant enough to know about everything, least of all me. That's why I like having discussions so that ideas may be shared and along the way I learn something new. Of course, in your case you are certainly the exception to all that. You know everything.

---END QUOTATION---



Naw, I just don't answer questions that I don't know the answer to, or talk about things I have no idea about. Saying that USMC doesn't and never will use a tube-fed shotgun is a little bit premature in light of the fact that they currently DO use them.

So, if you didn't say that, then you have nothing to worry about- and I wasn't talking about you.

You did, however, say that a Marine would never be happy with the performance of a tube-fed shotgun. Happiness would be directly proportional to its ability to adequately fulfill its role- which they seem to do. Generalisations like that are never really a great argument anyways.

So yes, cork.
  03:07:23  23 November 2004
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Harry-the-Ruskie
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/07/2004
 

Message edited by:
Harry-the-Ruskie
11/23/2004 3:16:00
Messages: 75

---QUOTATION---


Naw, I just don't answer questions that I don't know the answer to, or talk about things I have no idea about. Saying that USMC doesn't and never will use a tube-fed shotgun is a little bit premature in light of the fact that they currently DO use them.

So, if you didn't say that, then you have nothing to worry about- and I wasn't talking about you.

You did, however, say that a Marine would never be happy with the performance of a tube-fed shotgun. Happiness would be directly proportional to its ability to adequately fulfill its role- which they seem to do. Generalisations like that are never really a great argument anyways.

So yes, cork.
---END QUOTATION---



Looking right back at my earlier posts on this thread when I brought up this shotgun subject up, I was asking if anyone had any news of what became of the US Marine evaluation program of the mid-90s for a new inter-service shotgun. I also did say that prior to the evaluation the three services (Army, Navy and Marine) were all deploying shotguns that had been available to civilians but modified slightly for military usage (for example 'pistol grip' on some of them). Invariably all these were tube mags, so I was well-aware that USMC were using tube mag equipment.

I never said the USMC never liked tube mags shotguns and never used them

My question to the Forum was basically whether USMC had adopted any new shotgun at the conclusion of the evaluation program, and if indeed they did whether it was a box magazine as a box, as many gun commentators suggest has many advantages over a tube. In that context, I suggested perhaps it is sensible considering the advantages.

Further, in that context, I said you wouldn't expect Marines to take kindly of switching from a box mag "rifle" to something other than a box mag...a tube for example.....in that context I said in the earlier post :- "I don't know of many Marines today who would be happy with the idea of swapping a box magazine weapon for one weapon with a tube in firefight." I was referring to the assault rifles they are already carrying.

In that context, during the shotgun evaluation, I use that suggestion to ask why not consider going for a box mag to replace a tube mag in a shotgun?

I certainly never said anything like "....a Marine would never be happy with the performance of a tube-fed shotgun."

Perhaps I could have frame my initial sentences better. And sorry that my English sucks.

And Fux.....I never suggested I knew anything in depth of this matter. I started the whole subject asking questions, asking ideas, seeking clarification about that USMC evaluation program and whether anyone here could throw any light on whether in the end, they replaced their shotguns with something with a box magazine semi-auto configuration.
  05:41:03  23 November 2004
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Fux0r666
resident smart-ass
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On forum: 06/04/2003
Messages: 1927

---QUOTATION---
I don't know of many Marines today who would be happy with the idea of swapping a box magazine weapon for one weapon with a tube in firefight.
---END QUOTATION---



Yeah, you did. The problem with this statement is that it's applied globally and not role specific.

And I didn't say anything regarding you professing to know anything. I was replying to your comment on my arrogence. I was indirectly saying that I may appear arrogent because I only post to inform on subjects that I know a bit about- ergo, I argue my point, thus, I appear arrogent.
  09:29:47  23 November 2004
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Harry-the-Ruskie
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/07/2004
Messages: 75

---QUOTATION---
I don't know of many Marines today who would be happy with the idea of swapping a box magazine weapon for one weapon with a tube in firefight.

Yeah, you did. The problem with this statement is that it's applied globally and not role specific.

And I didn't say anything regarding you professing to know anything. I was replying to your comment on my arrogence. I was indirectly saying that I may appear arrogent because I only post to inform on subjects that I know a bit about- ergo, I argue my point, thus, I appear arrogent.
---END QUOTATION---



I believe what happened was a complete misunderstanding what I meant to say as a result of me not framing my initial sentences more specifically. As I explained I really meant it in the context of them not being happy to swap mag types in rifles (as an analogy) and using that to apply to their evaluation in searching for a new shotgun perhaps something with a box mag..(which in the end did not materialize as x5060 pointed out they were happy to retain the current types). So whatever it is, let's just cap this up by me saying I did not express myself more clearly at the start and therefore "My bad."

As for the comment 'arrogant', it was not prompted because as you said "I argue my point, thus, I appear arrogant."

It was prompted because of this :- "Lol. Someone musta corked his ass so he could no longer talk out of it."

In another post, I was replying to baff's comments on languages. I disagreed with him and gave reasons why I disagreed, but I don't remember saying one disparaging remark to put him down. It was a polite disagreement.

As much as I now admit above it is how I express myself that determines a difference in reaction from people, I guess that will also apply equally to you.
  13:21:16  23 November 2004
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x5060
Resident Nobody
(Resident)

 

 
On forum: 07/23/2003
Messages: 2015
Ok, lets all just take a breath now.

Harry - you said somethign and it came back to bite you in the ass.

Fux - DOWN BOY, BAD DOG *whack*
  14:34:10  23 November 2004
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Harry-the-Ruskie
(Senior)
 
On forum: 10/07/2004
 

Message edited by:
Harry-the-Ruskie
11/23/2004 14:34:56
Messages: 75

---QUOTATION---
Ok, lets all just take a breath now.

Harry - you said somethign and it came back to bite you in the ass.

Fux - DOWN BOY, BAD DOG *whack*
---END QUOTATION---



Yes it did. And I freely admitted that I should have framed my comments more carefully from the start.
  02:09:33  24 November 2004
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Zig
Ye Oulde Zigge
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On forum: 11/21/2003
 

Message edited by:
Zig
11/24/2004 2:10:21
Messages: 315
Wellllll what have we all learned..?

Marines like things that go booom

btw: one of my staff sgt.'s carried a shotgun in Afghanistan
 
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